On Sunday, Payton's buddy will be on the other sideline when the Saints face John Fox's Carolina Panthers in an important NFC South game.

There were no phone calls this week.

``It's hard during the season to ask for advice. The irony is that he's in the same division,'' Payton said. ``He's someone I would still talk with quite a bit, especially in the off-season or at those periodic NFL events that we're all at together. In season, it's a little harder with the schedule and the fact that we're in the same division.''

The friendship was formed when Payton joined the New York Giants' coaching staff in 1999, where Fox was the defensive co-ordinator. A year later, Payton was promoted to offensive co-ordinator and the Giants reached the Super Bowl that season, losing to Baltimore.

``He's someone who I consider a very close friend in this profession, said Payton, who added their wives are very close. ``When you share years like that with a team and you win an NFC championship and go to a Super Bowl, you build friendships that last forever. He's been a big influence on my career and someone who I consider a very close friend. Being with John for three years was something that was very valuable to me both professionally and personally.''

Fox, who left for Carolina after the 2001 season, said he was happy to dish out advice over the summer as Payton prepared to take his first head coaching job.

``In this league, you have to have people you talk to,'' Fox said. ``I've talked to him on a variety of occasions about a variety of different subjects, including once he got there. What to expect, just things that might be helpful.''

Payton and Fox came into similar situations in their first head coaching jobs. Fox took over after the Panthers went 1-15 in 2001. He immediately won his first three games in his first season. A year later Fox led Carolina to its first Super Bowl.

Payton, who took over a 3-13 team, has also started 3-0 and rebuilding New Orleans is crazy about the Saints.

``The situation that we are in here, you can draw some similarities. You're trying to turn a program around,'' Payton said. ``We're aspiring to do what John's been able to do with Carolina in the last four or five years. There's a foundation that he's been able to put in place there. With that has come the Super Bowl appearance and postseason games. The success that they've had is not only a credit to John, but the organization and the players. That's what we're trying to get done here.''

On Sunday, with both coaches knowing each other's styles and tendencies, it should be an interesting chess match.

And don't expect their friendship to override their competitive streaks.

``My advice is selective,'' Fox said. ``In all seriousness, most of the time when you talk to guys it's in the off-season. If we can help each other in any way where it wouldn't be at a competitive disadvantage, we would. But I doubt I'll talk to him this week until just before the game, on the field.''